IGF064 In Good Faith with Sister Gloria Ardenio Agnes, Maryknoll Sister, Vocation Director

Sister Rejane  
Hello, I am Sister Rejane Cytacki, the director of A Nun's Life Ministry. Today's podcast grew out of a podcast I did with Susan Flansburg, author of Feels Like Home: A Single Catholic Woman's Guide to Religious Life in the US. Susan and I were talking about four of the big categories of religious life: apostolic, monastic, missionary, and cloistered/ contemplative communities. Those are big categories to unpack. And I thought, let's just have a conversation between sisters who are from communities that identify in those categories. Therefore, today, I -- Sister Rejane, who am an apostolic Sister of Charity -- will be talking with my guest Sister Gloria Agnes, who is a Maryknoll Sister. The Maryknolls are a missionary community. We want to just talk about some of the similarities and the differences of being missionary and apostolic religious women. Welcome, Sister Gloria.

Sister Gloria  
I'm glad to be here with you.

Sister Rejane  
Sister Gloria, would you just tell our audience how you were first attracted to the Maryknoll sisters?

Sister Gloria  
Way back in my homeland, the Philippines, I was studying theology. And it happened that our Dean was a Maryknoll Sister. And one of my professors was also a Maryknoll Sister. So what really attracted me to them is their simplicity, you know, and their dedication to work. So I just saw that they are very humble. Students could easily reach out to them. And fortunately, also, I happen to be one of the student body. So I always had the chance to encounter our Dean. And I just love their passion to work, their passion to be with the people. So that's my first attraction to Maryknoll.

Sister Rejane  
Thank you for sharing that. You know, for me, with the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth, I was able to live with them two separate times in an intentional community for young women. But I wasn't officially entering. So it was kind of like, you know, trying it on and an observation. And at the same time, I was exploring other communities by going on retreats at different places. But I kept coming back to the Sisters of Charity of Leavenworth, because even though we shared life together, our ministries were all different. And so we'd come to the supper table and share what happened in our day. And I just loved it. To share the life -- there was so much joy. And they were also located in the heart of where marginalized people live. And that impressed upon me, because I'd always grown up in the suburbs. So, that was what kind of first attracted me: the joy, and what you said about being with the people. I'm wondering if it might help our audience just to talk about the differences, right? Because we were just talking prior to this. And, you know, some people might say, well, you're splitting hairs. But I think some of what's the difference between apostolic and a missionary community is, what were you originally founded for; what was the original purpose? Do you want to talk about that from your standpoint with the Maryknoll Sisters?

Sister Gloria  
Sure. You know, the Maryknoll Sisters, our foundress was studying during her college. She saw that some of these students, they always gathered together in that early time. That's what we call now like exchange students. So some Protestant students in this college were our foundress, Mother Mary Joseph, studied, she saw that some of the students would go to other countries and that really inspired her. That was her starting point, to dream about her vocation, the missionary vocation. So you at that time were more known as a Protestant country. U.S. is more a receiver, the missionary receivers, rather than the sender. So our foundress dreamed that, how about going to China? So, with the help of the Maryknoll Fathers Society founder, Father James Walsh, she started to put her dream together. And so as early as 1926, in our journey as Maryknoll missioners, we were able to send missioners to China. So the purpose was really to be missionaries outside the US.

Sister Rejane  
Wow. And so China was your first place? Is that correct?

Sister Gloria  
Right. So from China, they went to different parts of Asia. And then they went to Latin America and Africa.

Sister Rejane  
Wow. I like how you said that originally, the US were receivers of missionaries. A lot of the European countries were sending priests in the early days of our country, so in a way, Mother Mary Joseph really had a different take on, "Okay, it's time for us to be the senders." I like that. I really like that. You know, and I think, looking at some of the apostolic communities -- mine included -- we were originally founded in our country of origin. And it was, like my community, to teach, serve in orphanages, and serve in hospitals. And then we would get requests to go other places. And as apostolic sisters, yes, we can move to other places. But originally, we weren't necessarily founded that way. And while we did have a request in the 50s to go to Peru, and we now have native Peruvian sisters, we really kind of do formation and ministry in our home countries. We don't tend to move for ministry. I know I'm speaking in generalizations, but in talking with other apostolic groups, you have branches internationally, but you kind of stay in your country of origin and minister there. Do you want to talk a little bit about formation for you, as a missionary sister?

Sister Gloria  
Sure. You know, part of our formation to becoming a Maryknoll Sister is to prepare us to go to mission -- mission that is outside our homeland. For example, myself, I am originally from the Philippines, and I stayed with the sisters in the Philippines for a short time. And then I moved here in the US, so I was here for more than two years. And then I went to my first mission assignment, which was Bolivia. I was in Bolivia for almost two years, I went back here in the US for almost a year, and then I was sent to El Salvador. And part of that formation, even from the very beginning of our formation life, it is already emphasized that our way of life is we go to the place that we are -- people don't like us, but we are needed, you know. And then when the people learn to like us, and we are no longer needed in the place, so we have to move to another place. Part of this preparation, also, like when I went to Bolivia, I had to learn the language so that I could minister around, I could work around. So culture is also one of the things that we are talking and discussing about, learning the culture. We cannot be fully like the local people, but at least we could be and live with the people.

Sister Rejane  
Wow. So when you go to another country, you're not planning to be there long-term, sounds like. Because you want to turn it back over to the people -- correct? Any of your ministries?

Sister Gloria  
That's correct in some places. In the early time of the Maryknoll Sisters, we had a lot of institutions like hospitals, schools, retreat houses. But during Vatican II, slowly we turned over all our institutions to the local people, or any foundation. So, now our work is really more in the marginalized people. We don't have structural institutions like before, but we respond according to what is the need of the place. For example, when I went to Bolivia, there is an orphanage for boys. And the kids are children who hunger for love, you know, because they are abandoned by their parents. They are marginalized in society. And so that's where I engage myself. And when I moved to El Salvador, one of our sisters who happened to be a medical doctor, she put out a foundation that directly and indirectly works with the people who are HIV positive. So I help her with that. My work is to visit the patients, make sure that they are really faithful in taking their medicines, that they have good nutrition, that they go to the doctors, or we even provide a psychologist for them. So whatever the need that they have. But also, we have to clarify to the people: this foundation is founded by a Maryknoll Sister, but does not belong to the Maryknoll congregation. So when we left El Salvador, we also turned it over to the local people.

Sister Rejane  
And is it still running?

Sister Gloria  
It is. It is running through some funding agencies.

Sister Rejane  
I love how your community really had the foresight -- you said after the Vatican Council -- that it's not about trying to keep certain institutions going. You needed to let the people themselves -- empower them to continue to meet the needs.

Sister Gloria  
Right.

Sister Rejane  
Even in the US, I know my community and several communities, we call them sponsored works, which are kind of like the institutions. And we're trying to figure out, how do we make them self-sustainable? We, as Sisters, cannot run them all the time. So I love to hear that your community started this a long time ago. And I think it speaks to cultural sensitivity.

Sister Gloria  
Right. And it's also one way to make the local people aware about the needs of their own people, because I think they themselves are capable of learning and helping one another.

Sister Rejane  
Mm hmm. For sure. So what kind of discussions or activities did you do in formation to help you be open to so many different cultures?  I'm just curious, because that was not part of my formation.

Sister Gloria  
Right. You know, that's really very interesting and very engaging. Since we come from different backgrounds, in all aspects, you know, cultures, races, the way we are brought up home, it's very much different, and even our way of prayer, but one thing that I really like about Maryknoll, they allow us to evolve, and to learn from one another, that kind of openness to learn from one another. So that is already being nurtured and cultivated from the very beginning of our formation that we have to learn from one another. So for example, the way you pray is different. We really don't have prayer that's very structural, that this is the way we should be. Rather, each one is allowed to discover her own creativity in sharing that to the community. And it's really very enriching for us -- not only for our soul, but also for our personhood, to learn. And I think this is also one factor that helped us when we arrived at our mission place, that we already had some learnings that we learned from our formation years. And we learn how to be more flexible, you know, how to adapt to the things that are not your own, how to be uncomfortable sometimes and get out of your comfort zone.

Sister Rejane  
So you do talk about that. I mean, I did spend just a month in Peru, with our sisters, very short-term. But yes, so much of who you are, and how you operate comes out of your culture. And you have to almost -- I don't know what the word is. Pause it? I don't I don't know if you have a better way. But being open to other ways of doing -- just something as simple as running a meeting.

Sister Gloria  
Right.

Sister Rejane  
In the US, time is everything. So I say we're starting at nine o'clock, we're starting at nine o'clock. And I remember in Peru, we were supposed to start at nine o'clock. But we waited until every person arrived. And that was a half hour to 45 minutes later. And when the last person arrived, she still went around and greeted everyone. And my US sensibilities -- looking at my watch going, "This is such a waste of time, blah, blah, blah." And I had to just  let that go. Because I was like, wow, this is person-centered. They are greeting each other; that that person is valuable. We are going to wait for you. Um, I don't know. That was an insight. And I'm not a missionary. But I'm just curious if you have things like that.

Sister Gloria  
You got it. You know, one thing that also I love about being in mission outside my homeland: I am learning a lot from people. I think in the beginning I had this envisioning that people will learn from me, but it was twisted. I was the one who learned from them. And they became part of me. And I think if you ask people whose way of life is same with us, they would say the same: that the people that we are missioned with become part of us. For me, they are the one who really completed -- or it's not fully complete, but they are the ones who really make me who I am. Who makes meaning to my missionary vocation. They are the reason why I am here.

Sister Rejane  
Wow. That's powerful.

We are going to take a moment for a brief break. This is In Good Faith, a program of A Nun's Life Ministry. We want to thank our sponsors and individual donors like you, whose support makes the In Good Faith program possible. Please visit anunslife.org for more information, to donate, or to become a sponsor of the ministry. We will be right back.

Hello, listeners, we are back. If you want to find Susan Flansburg's book Feels Like Home, there will be a link to it in our Show Notes. Let's finish our conversation with Sister Gloria Agnes. You know, the sister I live with -- Sister Pat Johanssen -- did spend four years in South Sudan with Solidarity for South Sudan. And it's been at least five years since she's been there. But it's so much, like you said, a part of her, many of her stories. And so I think that's powerful that living with people from a different culture, it becomes part of you, part of your soul. The land and the culture. Yeah.

Sister Gloria  
Right. You know, I remember when I was learning my language, I stayed in a Bolivian family. This three-year-old boy became my teacher. I myself am a teacher, you know. But then when I went to other countries, like Bolivia, I have to learn from the three-year-old.

Sister Rejane  
So that talks about humility, cultural humility. Speaking for myself as a US person, and just that story when I talked about my frustration. Maybe that's the ,instead of pause. It's cultural humility. And I don't think -- at least here in the US -- we're very good at what that means. And just be vulnerable enough, like you just did with a three-year-old, and let the three-year-old teach you.

Sister Gloria  
Right, right. I think you said a very, very good word: being vulnerable. To be a missionary, you really face your vulnerability before God.

Sister Rejane  
That's beautiful. That's really beautiful. You know, I want to circle back to what you said about prayer. And that you're allowed to have creativity -- and I'm sure that allows some of your cultural prayers to come forth. Am I right?

Sister Gloria  
Right.

Sister Rejane  
You know, often we do a morning prayer, breviary, but we do allow for some creativities for sure. But we also find that we have to be flexible because we're apostolic. Where do we find group prayer? We're not praying five times a day, we're probably lucky to do one time a day together. And sometimes it's morning, sometimes it's evening. It depends on our schedule. Do you end up praying together?

Sister Gloria  
For us, from the very beginning of our missionary life, Eucharist is really a very important factor or part of our spiritual practices that bind us together, wherever we are in the world.

Sister Rejane  
That's beautiful, yes. I think that is one of the best commonalities for religious women, is the Eucharist. That we do come together. And what I've loved to see in this Archdiocese, is they're beginning to show some of the diversity of celebration. Whether it's an African Mass, but there's different countries of Africa. They go around the diocese, and have their Mass in different churches. So it's exposure, and people need to see. There's so many ways just within a Mass -- of song, music, prayers.

Sister Gloria  
Right. That's what we are doing here. For example, I am now in our motherhouse. If we have some celebration, big celebration, we integrate some practices in our country of mission. So it's really like, it's not the typical U.S. Mass, but it's really a collection of putting together all learnings that we have from our missions.

Sister Rejane  
Can you give an example of what some of those practices might be?

Sister Gloria  
In Africa, I don't know how to do it, but it's really like they make some sounds, like when singing the Hallelujah there was [ululates]. I was trying to learn from one of my Sisters, an African from Tanzania, but it's still hard for me to roll my tongue and create that sound. But I really love it when she starts doing that, when we have a big celebration. And other kind is like offertory. So instead of the typical offertories, the bread and wine, right? Sometimes, for example, First Profession, and the Sister is coming from Latin America. So they would incorporate some of their practices, like during offertory, they would offer whatever part of their culture that is anticipated in the liturgy. So it's really very enriching and also a way for us to appreciate and just admire other cultures and practices.

Sister Rejane  
And it sounds like it makes people feel welcome. I guess I should ask, on the other hand, are there tensions sometimes, trying to work through the miscommunication from different cultures? Do you find that?

Sister Gloria  
We are very rich about that. [laughter] You know why? First the language itself, that we thought we understand each other, English is our medium. But we ended up not understanding, you know. So that also creates some tensions. And then some assumptions that we thought, well, in my culture, this is the way we do it. And the other one will say "Well, in my culture that is interpreted this way." So there is already a conflict of understanding with one expression. Food. Food is also one way that needs to be discussed and talked about because some people, this is their comfort food. For example, I was in Bolivia. In the Philippines, our comfort food is rice. When I went to Bolivia, for a month, I didn't have rice. It's all potatoes and bread. So that's also another way that we dialogue. We learn how to dialogue about our food. Our way of being in the house, you know, the way we arrange the house, we have to discuss that one. So there are a lot of things that creates conflict. But our common way is that we are called to become a Maryknoll. And therefore, we agree that we have to discuss and put together our differences and our commonalities. In the beginning, our mother foundress, Mother Mary Joseph, would always encourage the Maryknoll Sisters, if you have a hard time to live with your Sister, find just even a little way that gives you a reason to live with her. And I think that is carried away until now. Wow.

Sister Rejane  
That's beautiful. She even recognized the conflict that's there. But you've got to try and work it out. You can't just let it go. Do you have conflict mediation tools, or it's just you've got to talk it out?

Sister Gloria  
Well, it depends upon a community that we belong in. When I was in El Salvador, there was a conflict in our community. And we really discussed it. Whatever we learn along the way, we put that together. I personally, I was scared because I was brand new in El Salvador, in the community. But I think one thing that I really appreciated, as I said in the beginning, we learn to learn from one another. And you learn to accept and embrace that your mistakes, you learn to love your skills. We learn to share practices that could make us a better person, a better community, a community that could live together. And we are still learning.

Sister Rejane  
That's beautiful. I think that's a wonderful place for us to stop. I think the intentionality that you've just talked about, and that it's all about learning and being vulnerable. But how powerful of a witness, that we know that our faith is international and to try to live it is a great witness. And with people from all over the world,

Sister Gloria  
Right.

Sister Rejane  
Thank you so much, Sister Gloria, for this time.

Sister Gloria  
You're welcome. And also thank you for inviting me to be with you.

Sister Rejane  
You bet. You bet. Okay, take care.

In Good Faith is a production of A Nun's Life Ministry, helping people discover and grow in their vocation by engaging questions about God, faith, and religious life. This program is made possible through the grace of God and the support of our sponsors of A Nun's Life Ministry, and you, our listeners. Don't forget to call us and leave a message. Tell us what you like, ask a question, or just say hi. Call 913-214-6087 and visit us at anunslife.org. God bless.

This transcript has been lightly edited for readability.